386: How Jodi Katz Discovered the Power of One-on-One Connections to Build Community

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So what's essential in this business and what hasn't changed since day

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one for me is like, we need to be able to pivot. We need to

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be agile and nimble, and we are. Like, we keep evolving

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the way that we do our work from the process, the types of

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work that we do, the services we offer, the type of experts

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that we need. Because if we sit still, we're dead, right?

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Like, that's the truth. But if we evolve with the

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times and try to stay ahead of what's coming next, then we're going to be

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able to deliver that service to the client that they're looking

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for.

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Welcome back to Podcast Junkies. Today I'm joined by Jodi Katz. She's the founder of

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Base Beauty and the host of Where Brains Meet Beauty. It's a long-running niche

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podcast built around conversations, candid conversations, career

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journeys, and the people shaping the beauty industry. And Jodi, you've

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created a show with a really clear point of view and a strong sense of

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community. So I'm really, really excited to dig into how it started, how you

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positioned it and what it's taken to sustain it over the long haul. So welcome.

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Thank you so much. This is so fun to be here. So you've built a

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really distinctive show with Where Brains Meet Beauty, and it feels like

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something that's rooted in maybe your career journeys, the people you've spoken

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to, honest conversations. And I get the sense you're building up this sense of

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community. So I'd love to start at the beginning. What was happening in your

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world when the idea for this podcast first came to you? What made it feel

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like it was a conversation worth creating? I love answering a question

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like this because it was not my idea. The show was actually

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the idea of my business coach who I had just started working with like

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2 months beforehand. And this was about 10 years ago at

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this point. And he was teaching me like the

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basics of like leading a business. And I've had my business now for

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19 years. So this was not day 1, right? I was already had a

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business and I just kind of felt stuck in it. So I hired a coach

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and he would try to be teaching me and telling me to like go to

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all these networking events. And I'm like, Alan, I don't want to go to a

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Fashion Week party. Please don't make me stand at the bar and try to fight

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for conversation. Like, I just want to go home after the workday, put my

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PJs on and watch The Real Housewives. And I

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told him I'm just not that great in groups. Like, I

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don't know how to navigate, like, getting like part of the

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conversation when there's a lot of voices. But I told him I was really good

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one-on-one. So he took that note back

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with him and he woke up the next morning and he called me and he

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said, Jodi, you should start a podcast. And I would, I said, Alan, why would

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I do that? He said, because you'll get to talk to people one-on-one. Yeah. And

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I believed him. So my team and I Googled how to make a podcast

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and that was, you know, 9 years ago and 300+ episodes

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later, I've gotten the chance to use the show

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selfishly as free business coaching and

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free therapy because we talk about real-world

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stuff. Like, we are not robots in this business, right? We're all human

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beings. We might have kids and dogs and cats and, you know, other things to

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do and be focused on outside of work. And I really

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need other human beings helping me navigate my life. So

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I have it for selfish reasons, but I do get great feedback from our listeners

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that these lessons and wisdom or applicable to their world as well. I love

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that story and it's something that I harp on. Obviously we, you know, started

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roughly around the same time. This show's been going on 11 years. I call

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podcast your virtual stage, which I love because it's like you decide

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yourself. You don't have to wait for opportunities to be on other people's stages. You

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can decide how you wanna build those relationships. And for me it was in the

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podcasting space 'cause I came in with zero visibility, but I quickly

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realized in those early days there was only Skype and call recorder,

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so there was no, I could get the video, but I couldn't record it. But

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I, I knew from day one that I wanted a video. I said, if I'm

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gonna spend an hour with this person, I want them to see my face. I

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want them, I wanna build this relationship. And then I'd go to like Podcast Movement

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and they'd be like, hey Harry, like thanks for that chat. It was really nice.

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And I'm sure it's some, an experience you've had as well. Well, we've had so

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many formats through the years as the technology has advanced like you. So in the

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early days it was, I don't know, a Zoom-like thing. I don't remember what

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it was called. And then we made the move to doing

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live recordings, like face-to-face in a room together, which I love

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so much. So we would rent some spaces and

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studios in New York, and when that became like cost prohibitive, 'cause it, it

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really adds up, we realized that in our WeWork there was a

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room that we could use as a, a recording studio. So we used that for

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a while. Then we, when we built out the office that we're in currently, we

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built out a studio within the office so we have a place to do it.

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There. And of course, during COVID we had to, you know, move to online.

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But the face-to-face experience has been so

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meaningful for me that we actually made the decision last year to move all of

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our recordings to not just live with the guests, but actually

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in front of an audience. So we record all of our episodes at what we

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call listening parties, and we invite industry friends

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to sit in the audience and watch the show get made. That sounds like a

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lot of fun. And a lot of different pivots in terms of the

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formatting. And I know that you have our opening question that says, "What'd you want

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to be when you grew up?" So, that's such a great entry point. What made

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that feel like something that would be like, like an icebreaker or the right way

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into a conversation? Thanks for noticing that. It's actually become quite

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fun to track these. We started this during COVID because we had been in

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person with our guests for many years at that point. Then we had to be

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virtual. And given that this is a career journey show, it just

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became obvious that like we all think about like, you know, our careers very,

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very early in our our lives, right? We have these dreams. I want to be

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an astronaut. I want to be a dancer. I want to be a soccer player.

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And I just asked it on a whim without any, like, actually planning or

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deep thought about it the first time. And like, oh my God, like, there's something

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here. So we've been doing this probably for, at this point, half the

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life of the show. And it's fascinating

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because a lot of times our guests will say, you know, they were daydreaming when

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they were 10 years old. And it's, you know, not that far off from what

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they're doing now. They might not be, like, a professional athlete, but the reasons why

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they wanted to be a professional athlete is actually completely tied

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to this sort of like performance that they deliver in

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their work every day. We've had a lot of people who wanted to be dancers,

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singers, and they actually do perform. You know, they're on QVC

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or they're on TikTok selling their products, right? It's really kind of fascinating.

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So now that we have AI at our fingertips, the team is gonna do

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a deep dive through all those transcripts with AI and ask it to

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pull out like all of the responses so that we can start to have data

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on like 50% of beauty industry leaders wanted to be

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astronauts when they grew up and things like that and have a lot of fun

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with the data. So when you first started the show, how has it

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changed? Like, who specifically did you want to pitch

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it to? Like, did you have an ideal listener in mind when you started? We

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always wanted to have a show that was a platform for

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people that were not just the household names,

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right? So we're happy to have the household names on our show, right? There are

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some notable people who have started and lead beauty brands or

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some celebrities, right, who have their own brands and happy to have those

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people on our show. But it was really important to us

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that we also have those people who are behind the scenes because

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I always felt like an outsider in the beauty industry. I didn't work at

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Estée Lauder or Coty and any of these big companies. I was sort of like

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a different path. So I didn't want this to be just another

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vehicle for notable people. I wanted to make sure that we were elevating the

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voices of the people who are working hard every day. And we stayed true to

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that through the years, which I'm really proud of. And, you know, those are our

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clients on the agency side. We have our own agency called Base Beauty,

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and we've had that— I've had that business for 19 years. So who are our

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clients? It's not the celebrity. The celebrity is not in the thick of the work

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with us, right? It's the people behind the scenes who are super smart and very

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passionate. And I want to make sure their voices were heard. So I definitely want

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to give you the opportunity to plug the agency as well. So without going too

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deep into the weeds here, but talk a little bit about How it started and

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who do you serve? Great question. I love this. So I'll tell you what we

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do first and then I'll go back in time. We are a creative agency and

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we focus in 4 categories. That's beauty, wellness,

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personal care, and aesthetics. So those are the only places we play. We're

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not working on fast food or automotive clients, but within those

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categories, we're experts in creative, social media,

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influencer, and PR. And we choose those areas of focus because

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that's where we're able to build trust and relevance with the consumer. And

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without trust and relevance, you have nothing, right? You just have, you know, some goop

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in a jar. So that's what we focus on every day. And I created the

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agency 19 years ago because I saw a white space. I was

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working as the creative director of a French beauty company. I was in

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New York and I needed to give overflow work to agency

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partners who can help us with our workflow. And I couldn't find any

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specialists in beauty and fragrance and skincare. I only

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found a whole bunch of like sort of fashion boutique agencies. So it

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got me thinking, well, if there's a white space, why don't I fill it?

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So from that first moment after I left that full-time role, we at

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Base Beauty have been focusing on those categories: aesthetics, beauty, personal care,

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and wellness, and being as robust in our offering as

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possible so that the benefit to the client is a really strong partner

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across all those different functions. You said 19 years?

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19 years. Yeah. Well, congrats on approaching the 20-year mark. I know as

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an entrepreneur myself, it's, uh, A series of ups and downs for sure.

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Well, interesting you've mentioned that cuz I can't do this without the

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business coaching that I've had now for 10 years and weekly therapy.

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And I'm also not afraid to be vulnerable. Yeah. So we'll go there together now,

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Harry. It's taken me 19 years to get

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to the point where I had this idea in my head this weekend. Why am

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I expecting it to be easy? Yeah. Like, So it took me

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19 years to realize like my perfectionist tendency

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is sort of trying to paint a picture of a story of what it's like

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to run a business. And it's false. It doesn't make any sense.

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So as of today, you're meeting me that first day where I am going to

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move through the world knowing that there's bumps in the road, knowing that that's

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to be expected, 'cause that's where we learn and we grow. And

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hopefully realizing this and accepting it will

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make those hard things a little less hard for me. I love that. And it's

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so true. And, and unless you've been in the trenches and doing it, it's hard

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to relate. And it's, you know, that first day when you don't get that check

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deposited in your account, you know, as a paycheck and you're like, oh, like I

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gotta figure this out myself. And then the journey that goes on from there. But

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I appreciate you being vulnerable. What do you think shifted for you to

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have that realization? I wish I knew because maybe I would've

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had more serenity. The past 19 years if I was able to

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realize this. You know, I'm definitely a recovering perfectionist and I

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thought a lot of those tendencies sort of washed away.

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And I realize this is really deeply rooted in this idea

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that like there is a perfect out there, that we shouldn't be

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uncomfortable. And that's just not real life. And it's

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certainly not business, right? Even if I wasn't running the business, if I was

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an employee in a business, not every day is easy. Right? So I wish

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I knew why I couldn't peel that onion sooner, but I'm

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glad that I did today. And I look forward

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to, you know, moving through this entrepreneurial life and growing in

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the agency with that acceptance so that I can have more

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serenity and also more joy and fun in the work. Yeah, that's so important,

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especially now with everything that's happening in the world, that if we don't have the

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opportunity to enjoy what we're doing, then we should be questioning why we're doing it

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in the first place. Right. Howie, that's actually something I work with my

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coach on a lot. When I feel stuck or really frustrated,

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he points me back to my joy. Like, where is my joy in this?

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And it's a common thread through the past 10 years

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because I'm not doing this because someone forced me

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to, right? I chose this path. I really believe

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that Base Beauty is excellent at what we do and that more and more clients

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should come and find us and use us as a resource. And I believe this

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business can grow in the way that I imagine. But I

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don't want to feel like it's torture. I want to have joy in my

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work. I want to show my team how fun this can be, this

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adventure. I want to show my kids and, you know, be a role model for

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my kids that, like, hard work pays off. So I do

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need that reminder, though, to find my joy. And we're always able to find it.

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We're always able to pinpoint, like, one thing, even in a really hard situation where

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I can tap into that joy. Well, I appreciate you reminding me because,

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and hopefully I don't have to wait another 8 years to

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find my serenity. I think conversations like this are sometimes serendipitous

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and, you know, having them in the right time. So, you know, the more I

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was looking into like your backstory, I was like, I'm excited to like have this

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conversation. And it's one of the reasons why I love the platform so much

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and having this stage. So I'm curious in your role as

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a host, what have you noticed? Like how have you developed? How have you grown

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from those like early day one recordings to how you feel comfortable behind the mic

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now? Well, thankfully now I have a producer

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who is really focused on making it

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easy for me to do what I do. So we have

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organized our show into quarterly themes and we build quarterly

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themes around either things that interest us or something that's happening in the industry.

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So, uh, for example, our theme for Q1 this year was called Power

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Duos. And we brought guests that actually like

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work together as a duo. So we have had some husband and wife

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teams, sisters, people from different generations, but they work

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very closely together. And, or like unlikely

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pairings, you know, someone who's like super finance-minded versus, and someone who's

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super creative-minded and how they work together. So it was a theme that was

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interesting to us cuz when we get, would get pitched guests, we're like, oh, isn't

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that interesting? They're sisters, they're husband and wife, you know, they're brothers.

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So that power duo's theme really sets the tone for like then

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what— her name is Natasha— what Natasha and I do together, which is, you know,

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reach out to our network for guests. So we get pitched by publicists, but we

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also know a lot of people. So we go out to our friends in the

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industry and ask if they have recommendations. Then what we do to

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build the listening party is we have 6 slots for recording all in

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one day. So we're recording 6 episodes in one day, back to

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back in front of a live audience. So this is why

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I need Natasha, because if I had to do all of those

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intake calls myself, prep all of those questions myself,

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and then like be on a stage right in front of an audience for

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6 straight hours, I don't think it would have— it would be

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sustainable for me. Right. I really need that partner in the work. Where are you

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recording? We record in our office. So Base Beauty has an office in Midtown New

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York, and we set up a really pretty

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space for— it's almost like a horseshoe format.

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We are at the table, I'm at the table with my guests, and then in

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a horseshoe format, the listeners are sitting there. And then we have food and

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drinks in another room. So in between episode recordings,

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people are taking pictures with our guests and, you know, meeting people, but then they're

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also able to get snacks. We always want to feed people. And it's an open

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house format. So people are coming and going, you know, based on their schedule,

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they pop in for an episode or two, then they go, you know, finish their

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work for the day. I love that format. And is there, there's an audience there

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too, so you invite people into, into the office, right? So it's a way for

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us to celebrate our network, right? We have a lot of friends in the

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industry, clients, former clients, so we invite them to

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sit in the room and they become part of the show too, right? There's

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a lot of interactivity between the guests at the table recording with me and the

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people in the audience. People are laughing and clapping or

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shouting things out. And that's a dynamic that I need too. You know,

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after 300 episodes, I don't wanna hear myself anymore,

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right? I really want to hear the voices of the people that I'm interviewing

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and our friends and industry, other industry leaders who

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can contribute. Have you noticed in yourself your ability

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to hold, maintain, continue conversations has improved?

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Because for myself personally, I find that now I can be a better listener,

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ask more open-ended questions, pull threads. And I'm curious if you've noticed like that skill

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for you. I think it's my superpower. I, I'm

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a really excellent listener, which is where the energy is

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required, especially for the back-to-back recording. I'm

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really listening so hard because I'm genuinely curious.

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And I'm genuinely curious because I need your help,

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right? If you're in the chair as a guest, I need your help. You might

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not know it. You don't know. You might not know you're my therapist for the

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day, but all of my questions, all my

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curiosity is coming from a really authentic place, which is I'm alone in

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running this business, you know, as the sole CEO. I've been doing this a long

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time. This industry is wackadoo sometimes. There's pressures, you know,

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outside of anything that we can control that we have to navigate. Every

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minute of the day, something changes in algorithms or whatnot of what

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best practices are. So I come to it with that genuine

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curiosity, supported by the fact that Natasha has done a lot of prep for me.

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And we talk to each other through the computer screen that I have to my

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side when I'm interviewing, right? So if something is said by one of the

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guests and it comes up and it's relevant, so, you know, something that's important to

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me, she'll leave me a note or highlight something. Which is actually, you know, for

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me, it's super fun. I'm like, I have a friend on the other side of

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the wall who's helping me here, and it makes me smile. But yeah, my

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superpower is, I think, listening so closely that it makes the

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conversation feel really complete. And,

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Hari, that comes also from the fact that I've been in so many rooms where

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these panel discussions and moderators doing their job,

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and the guest will say something, and like, I'm like, the obvious

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follow-up question is to ask ABC, and they just move

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on to their, to their next question. The card's like, oh my God, this is

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the secret to the universe, and you could have asked that question and we could

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have gotten that answer. So I've been frustrated and

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disappointed so many times that like, I wanna be that for my

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listeners. I wanna make sure that they close the loop, right? That the questions that

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are top of mind that are being inspired, that they get answers.

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Everyone needs a Natasha. Yeah. I always say in a

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podcast conversation, there's 3 people, the host, the guest, and the listener.

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Thank you, Laura. Like one person is listening to us having this conversation now. And

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if we don't lose sight of that, and you have a live audience, you have

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the benefit of seeing the people that are listening in that moment, but it's always

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helpful to make it like an all-encompassing conversation. 'Cause it's not

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as much as like we're having this conversation, you and me, it's eventually gonna get

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published. And I always wanna create that environment for folks as

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well. So, well, Hari, I think about that because very early on, like year

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1 of the show, I got a note from someone in my network who said

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she listened to the show and what was being discussed was so important to

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her and she was driving at the time, she pulled over to the side of

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the road and started taking notes. Okay, so that's what I think about. Are all

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of my listeners pulling over to the side of the road to take notes? Probably

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not, but somebody is, right? And

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I am in service to them to make sure that they get, you know, if

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I wanna glean wisdom, I want them to as well. So that's what's always on

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my mind is that type of listener who's like really desperate and

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craving for that humanity. In understanding their career journey

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within the beauty industry. Did you always have that superpower? My

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superpower is like the overall one. And if you

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go to my LinkedIn, it says under my name, I'm a fortune teller.

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So it's seeing 10 steps ahead and I'm listening for what's 10

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steps ahead, right? So the listening comes out of that, right? I have a

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really strong trust of my instincts. I piece things

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together very quickly. I see trends very quickly.

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And I'm able to create something that actually means

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something out of all these inputs. And because I'm able to do that,

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it makes the listening skills really strong, right? Because

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I'm listening for what's next. Does that make sense? Yeah, yeah, I can definitely relate.

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And how far back can you remember, like, doing that? Well,

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early in my career, I would call myself like a brat or a

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jerk, like in my 20s. I, you know, graduated from

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college, got a good job, thought I was smarter than everybody who had

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been working in the industry for 30 years. And

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I was, you know, probably pretty disrespectful. I didn't understand

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hierarchy and I didn't respect it. Kind of some of that is this,

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though. You know, it's like there is something inside of me that said, like, you

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guys are missing something, right? You're not seeing the whole picture. You're only seeing this,

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like, you know, this moment in time. You're not thinking about what's next.

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And that trend would follow me through the years where, you know, I think it's

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sort of, I had no choice but to become my own, you know,

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business owner and not have a boss and to set my own sort of

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intentions in my work that I could see through to the end

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without, you know, interruption from other people's positions or

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decision making. So yeah, I think it's like there was just

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something inside of me since I was, you know, much younger. That

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knew something was out there. I couldn't have articulated it then. I really was, you

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know, a brat. But, you know, once I started, you know, being more serious

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in the marketing space and the beauty industry, you know, late 20s, early

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30s, I saw this skill developing. And then over time, I just

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decided to trust it. So if I spoke to your parents or your close friends,

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they wouldn't be surprised by what you did? Well, interesting.

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Like, my parents, I'm sure, like, not surprised, but

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I show up in the world very differently now than I did, you know, in

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my earlier career. I am so measured

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in my work and I really just wanna find the point from A to B

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that can create the most success for us, but also the most

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serenity. And I think this is one of the reasons why

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I love like watching reality TV, like the Real Housewives and all these shows,

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Below Deck and stuff, Summer House. I love these shows because these

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people make, you know, throw temper tantrums,

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right, as a part of their daily life. And I don't, right? I'm

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choosing measured because I know measured is better for me, even though I want to

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throw a temper tantrum, right? And the work is hard, so there's plenty of moments

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for temper tantrums. But watching these people throw their temper

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tantrums, like, it feels so good for me. It's like an outlet.

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But I will always choose the measured path. And it's something I'm sure

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that's lessons learned over the years that have a hard effect.

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How big is the agency now? We're about 20 people. We're based in

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Midtown New York and our clients are all over the country

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and we have 3 divisions. There's the creative team, the

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social media team, and the PR and influencer team, and they work very holistically

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together for our clients. It's been a lot— it's a tumultuous industry, isn't it? Like

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beauty and trends and obviously with everything happening with social, there's prob—

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I mean, you were there for the birth of it and I'm so happy Facebook

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wasn't around when I was growing up. There's stuff that I see

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online right now that just people are posting everything. So talk to me a little

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bit about that, like growing up in that era when that wasn't a

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function of our daily lives and how that's connected to what's

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happening in your space. Well, this is so interesting because we were

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there for the birth of social media being a marketing tool. My team

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years ago actually built the first influencer programs ever. Our

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client at the time was Clinique, which is one of the biggest beauty brands out

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there. And we built like what influencer marketing looks like. And many

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of those tactics we developed early on are still best practices today.

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So yeah, we've been on the front lines of this work for, you know,

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much longer than many agencies even existed. And what that

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gives us is incredible institutional knowledge and very, very deep

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industry knowledge. So when these changes happen

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and they happen every day, things out of our control in the marketing ecosystem,

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we can rely on that foundation, right, to make informed

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decisions about how to handle what's coming next. And the

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kind of funny thing about being a marketing LMPD or any other category

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is that when something new hits, right, a new algorithm, a new

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platform, a new whatever, nobody knows the answers, right?

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An agency with 1,000 people doesn't know more than we know. But

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what we can rely on is all of those years of that institutional and industry

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knowledge to inform like, Hey, well, we had this other thing, you know, that

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was invented and launched 5 years ago, and this is how we handled it. Let's

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try to modify something around there, you know, use what the data that we

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have to inform our decision making. So

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what's essential in this business and what hasn't changed since day one for me is

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like we need to be able to pivot. We need to be agile

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and nimble. And we are like, we keep evolving the way that we do

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our work from the process, the types of work that we do,

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the services we offer. The type of experts that we need, because

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if we sit still, we're dead, right? Like, that's the truth.

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But if we evolve with the times and try to stay ahead of what's

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coming next, then we're going to be able to deliver that service to the client

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that they're looking for. That's an interesting way to have been in that space early

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on, then seeing that the influencers were an important part of this

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area as well. There's a company called Glycen. I'll connect you with them later,

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but I'm an advisor to them and they focus on the influencer space. And help

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you find and work with influencers and do a lot of AI-based

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research into trends and stuff, which is a fascinating space to watch as

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well. And I imagine with the beauty space, with the new

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administration in terms of like what we can put in beauty products now

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or what needs to be taken out of products, I'm sure companies are like really

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scrambling to figure out how they compete or how they

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reposition themselves in this new environment. Well, the scrambling is

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happening for a whole lot of reasons, right? Tariffs and, you know, the tariffs

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coming and going is very complicated for our clients. You know, what

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we offer our clients is our true

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understanding of culture, right? So beauty is like

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fashion at the center of culture. And my team's

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language is culture, right? So they know like how much

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cultural gravity is created by like a service, a product, a

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treatment that you love. And it forms a belief system. So that's what

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we do. We build belief systems for our clients

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so that this cohort, this community of fans have something to

435

00:26:08,945 --> 00:26:12,636

grab on to. They're part of the culture too. So we do

436

00:26:12,636 --> 00:26:16,374

that with what we call value and velocity, right? Because everything has to happen

437

00:26:16,423 --> 00:26:19,584

so fast. And by the way, like no one's spending the amount of money on

438

00:26:19,680 --> 00:26:23,002

marketing they used to, right, 20 years ago. So we have to do more with

439

00:26:23,050 --> 00:26:26,644

less, but it has to be high quality. It has to be intentional. It has

440

00:26:26,676 --> 00:26:30,447

to be high performing, right? So there's a lot of pressures on the

441

00:26:30,447 --> 00:26:34,251

team to get this right. And our clients have a ton of pressure too, right?

442

00:26:34,299 --> 00:26:37,172

If the campaign doesn't work, they're scared they're going to lose their job. Right. These

443

00:26:37,172 --> 00:26:40,927

are real concerns. But we're at the center of culture and we're

444

00:26:40,959 --> 00:26:44,683

at the— our work happens where culture converts. So

445

00:26:45,052 --> 00:26:48,551

in beauty, and maybe beauty is unique here versus other industries,

446

00:26:48,888 --> 00:26:52,130

you cannot be a brand and market in a surface-level way.

447

00:26:52,916 --> 00:26:56,543

It doesn't work like the customer sees through it. They know you're not real

448

00:26:56,768 --> 00:27:00,236

or you're not invested. What happens when culture converts is we're

449

00:27:00,236 --> 00:27:03,882

speaking to the cohorts within a target

450

00:27:04,300 --> 00:27:08,058

that are like genuinely deeply interested in investing their

451

00:27:08,090 --> 00:27:11,607

time and their money into your skincare product or your haircare

452

00:27:11,607 --> 00:27:15,252

product or your, you know, fitness studio. So we actually,

453

00:27:15,477 --> 00:27:18,705

we have a chart in our capabilities deck that's like all these different

454

00:27:18,705 --> 00:27:22,383

cohorts, right? The biohackers, the longevity fans, the

455

00:27:22,383 --> 00:27:26,154

fragheads, the skin enthusiasts. All these different cohorts and they

456

00:27:26,234 --> 00:27:29,246

behave a little different from each other and we have to talk to them in

457

00:27:29,358 --> 00:27:33,044

really unique ways. Those are our fans, those are our future customers.

458

00:27:33,092 --> 00:27:36,297

That's where loyalty is built and that's where we're able to tell those

459

00:27:36,649 --> 00:27:40,335

stories around trust and relevance. I was making

460

00:27:40,335 --> 00:27:43,844

sure I could keep up with all of the cohorts. I almost lost you at

461

00:27:43,844 --> 00:27:47,530

Fragheads, but is that fragrance? Okay. Fragrance, right? Big fragrance

462

00:27:47,530 --> 00:27:51,023

fans. Then there's Skinthusiasts. So this would be— I'm sure you have some friends like

463

00:27:51,135 --> 00:27:54,803

this. They're not estheticians, they're not dermatologists, but by the way they

464

00:27:54,803 --> 00:27:58,503

speak, you think that they are, right? They're so invested in the education

465

00:27:58,503 --> 00:28:02,227

around skincare and high-performance medical-grade skincare. So they're the

466

00:28:02,227 --> 00:28:05,802

person that you turn to if you're like, should I get Botox? Should I get

467

00:28:05,850 --> 00:28:09,682

filler? And then there's, you know, there's biohackers are always looking for ways to

468

00:28:09,698 --> 00:28:13,321

improve like their longevity and their health, right? So I mean,

469

00:28:13,337 --> 00:28:16,960

that's just a small segment of who's out there, but that's what the work my

470

00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:20,110

team is doing because we're at the center of culture, right? And that drills down

471

00:28:20,226 --> 00:28:24,058

really deeply into these individual cohorts. Yeah, it seems like you have to people

472

00:28:24,074 --> 00:28:27,472

who keep their finger on the pulse with what's happening, not only in terms of

473

00:28:27,472 --> 00:28:31,321

the industries themselves, like for the biohackers community, that's obviously big in the entrepreneurial

474

00:28:31,337 --> 00:28:35,131

space as well. And all these longevity clinics that are opening up and,

475

00:28:35,519 --> 00:28:39,242

you know, it feels like people are becoming more, taking more responsibility for their

476

00:28:39,242 --> 00:28:42,963

health. So with AI, they're like, like I did myself, I dropped my results

477

00:28:42,963 --> 00:28:46,649

into ChatGPT and I'm like, you know, I'm having a longer conversation with

478

00:28:46,681 --> 00:28:50,335

ChatGPT than I am with my doctor because I, because they're going deeper, you know,

479

00:28:50,464 --> 00:28:54,192

and I can ask questions that I feel like I'm imposing. So, what trends, you

480

00:28:54,192 --> 00:28:57,179

know, obviously AI could be one of them, but what are you seeing that are

481

00:28:57,308 --> 00:29:01,082

the big trends that are affecting your space now? Well, I think that the trends

482

00:29:01,082 --> 00:29:04,744

are really about how we deliver information to customers, right? So

483

00:29:05,579 --> 00:29:09,354

because we have so many cohorts and they're all sort of unique in what

484

00:29:09,354 --> 00:29:12,807

they're looking for, we have to find ways to make our

485

00:29:12,807 --> 00:29:16,019

clients' resources go further than ever. Right. So

486

00:29:16,405 --> 00:29:20,082

maybe you're a brand with a Gen X target that's not the

487

00:29:20,178 --> 00:29:23,901

end of it, right? Like, what world are they part of? Are they skin enthusiasts

488

00:29:23,901 --> 00:29:26,902

or are they, you know, people who would— they call skip care, meaning like they

489

00:29:26,918 --> 00:29:29,839

want one product that does 9 things. They do not— they don't want to spend

490

00:29:29,839 --> 00:29:33,514

a ton of time doing their skincare. Like, we need to understand where

491

00:29:33,514 --> 00:29:37,076

those customers are, like what they relate to, and then we can tell really rich

492

00:29:37,124 --> 00:29:40,863

stories. So then the team is creating, you know, ad campaigns

493

00:29:41,056 --> 00:29:44,635

really targeting that customer. They're developing social media programs

494

00:29:44,827 --> 00:29:48,485

really targeting those customers. We're doing PR and influencer programs very

495

00:29:48,581 --> 00:29:52,398

targeted to those customers. So like I said, we can't be surface here,

496

00:29:52,992 --> 00:29:55,526

right? In this industry, we have to be very specific. But if we can win

497

00:29:55,590 --> 00:29:59,423

over one target and one cohort, well, then we can take those learnings and

498

00:29:59,423 --> 00:30:02,968

be like, oh, you know what, Gen X was our initial target, but we think

499

00:30:03,032 --> 00:30:06,449

that the millennials will like this because X, Y, Z. Let's replicate what we're doing,

500

00:30:06,481 --> 00:30:09,656

but for that audience, right? So we're able to test and learn with one

501

00:30:09,993 --> 00:30:13,730

audience and then bring those learnings and apply it to others and build more

502

00:30:13,794 --> 00:30:16,988

momentum for our clients. Yeah, it sounds like you have to have folks on the

503

00:30:16,988 --> 00:30:20,248

team who can keep their finger on the pulse of even naming

504

00:30:20,681 --> 00:30:23,668

what the current generation is named to, because I lose track at some point.

505

00:30:24,535 --> 00:30:28,228

That's right. Well, my team loves this world, right? People who work at Base

506

00:30:28,228 --> 00:30:31,953

Beauty just really want to be at the center of culture. That comes with

507

00:30:32,066 --> 00:30:35,887

also like all the tea spilling, right? Like we're— they're so close

508

00:30:36,015 --> 00:30:39,500

into like who these people are, who's moving the needle

509

00:30:40,174 --> 00:30:43,799

and You know, some of these people become friends of my team, right? Like

510

00:30:43,799 --> 00:30:47,585

they're people in their world. Our clients are at the center of culture. We

511

00:30:47,585 --> 00:30:51,258

have, you know, clients who are notable people. So there's something that's really

512

00:30:51,322 --> 00:30:54,353

quite fun about moving pop culture forward and the fact that we get to do

513

00:30:54,369 --> 00:30:57,834

this in an industry that makes people feel good and informs them,

514

00:30:58,154 --> 00:31:01,908

helps them make decisions. It's really quite fun. It sounds like the way

515

00:31:01,908 --> 00:31:05,548

you describe the show and the conversations, you really want to

516

00:31:05,613 --> 00:31:09,077

give a stage to people who are in this industry who have stories to tell.

517

00:31:09,767 --> 00:31:13,202

And are there any common threads that have been happening through these conversations,

518

00:31:13,234 --> 00:31:16,813

success stories, people talking about the same issues that you've noticed over time?

519

00:31:17,471 --> 00:31:21,258

Yes, great question. The theme, and we just heard from Power Duos, which

520

00:31:21,258 --> 00:31:24,837

was a Q1 show, was all about trust,

521

00:31:25,030 --> 00:31:28,175

right? We were talking to two people who work together closely,

522

00:31:28,865 --> 00:31:32,621

and the word trust kept coming up in so many conversations

523

00:31:32,717 --> 00:31:36,184

and used in multiple ways, right? I have to trust that my business

524

00:31:36,184 --> 00:31:39,781

partner, you know, will make the right allocation decisions for

525

00:31:39,797 --> 00:31:43,490

product in the warehouse. I have to trust my business partner that they're going to,

526

00:31:43,891 --> 00:31:47,729

you know, develop content and marketing that's going to help us sell the product that's

527

00:31:47,729 --> 00:31:51,534

sitting in the warehouse. Right. So the trust theme is really quite beautiful

528

00:31:51,534 --> 00:31:55,259

to see. Like I said, we had sisters, we had husbands and wives,

529

00:31:55,292 --> 00:31:58,985

we had life partners, we had best friends, and then unlikely

530

00:31:59,049 --> 00:32:02,835

pairings as well. So That was actually really reassuring for

531

00:32:02,835 --> 00:32:05,368

me in that moment because, you know, I have to have trust in my team

532

00:32:05,400 --> 00:32:09,103

too, right? Like, I can't do this alone and I

533

00:32:09,103 --> 00:32:12,052

don't want to do it alone also, right? That would be a really kind of

534

00:32:12,052 --> 00:32:15,627

sad way to run a business. So that's a very

535

00:32:15,819 --> 00:32:19,250

fruitful theme for Power Doers, and I would imagine that's going to continue. I think

536

00:32:19,250 --> 00:32:22,600

it's also a theme that's relevant to where we are today. Like, the world is

537

00:32:22,632 --> 00:32:26,126

topsy-turvy. You really just need to trust in someone and something

538

00:32:26,559 --> 00:32:29,493

to be able to get through the day. And as you've been having these

539

00:32:29,589 --> 00:32:33,420

conversations and over the years and the show has grown, was there

540

00:32:33,468 --> 00:32:36,482

a point where it was like an inflection point or like, I can't believe this

541

00:32:36,482 --> 00:32:39,784

just happened at the show, like a milestone moment? Or— I'd say one of the

542

00:32:39,784 --> 00:32:43,343

milestone moments for me was this is pre-COVID. So the show is about

543

00:32:43,631 --> 00:32:47,462

maybe 4 years old, 4 or 5 years old at this point. And

544

00:32:47,799 --> 00:32:51,342

we knew that doing the show, you know,

545

00:32:51,887 --> 00:32:55,702

one-on-one or over a Zoom-like tool is fine.

546

00:32:56,039 --> 00:32:59,742

But we also thought like, you know, there's people who really wanna be around the

547

00:32:59,726 --> 00:33:03,483

show as it gets made. So I had a friend who introduced me to

548

00:33:03,660 --> 00:33:07,402

the head of beauty at Saks Fifth Avenue, which is a notable department store.

549

00:33:08,076 --> 00:33:11,673

And this woman, Kate, said yes to my idea. And my idea was,

550

00:33:11,786 --> 00:33:15,351

let's bring the podcast onto the retail floor and invite your

551

00:33:15,383 --> 00:33:18,466

customers and our industry friends to come and watch the show get made, you know,

552

00:33:18,675 --> 00:33:21,951

and to be a part of it. And because it's Saks, every

553

00:33:21,999 --> 00:33:25,821

single show that we did there— and we did many on the floor in New

554

00:33:25,821 --> 00:33:29,418

York City at their flagship— their beautiful events and

555

00:33:29,932 --> 00:33:33,624

every time every single seat was filled. And of course, you know, it was like

556

00:33:33,624 --> 00:33:37,156

they had waiters passing hors d'oeuvres, they had a DJ, like they had

557

00:33:37,221 --> 00:33:40,849

gorgeous decor. They like really made it a moment and they understood the

558

00:33:40,849 --> 00:33:44,590

power of drawing in this event to also then

559

00:33:44,606 --> 00:33:48,154

push people to the retail floor. Right. So then they were able to collect data

560

00:33:48,218 --> 00:33:51,654

on, well, if we animate the store in this way, will it drive

561

00:33:51,702 --> 00:33:55,265

sales? And the answer was yes. So what I'm also really

562

00:33:55,297 --> 00:33:58,602

proud of from all of those shows, and I would always do like an informal

563

00:33:58,602 --> 00:34:02,277

survey at the top of the recording, I'd ask like, who is here just

564

00:34:02,277 --> 00:34:06,047

because they wandered by and then took a seat? Or were you here because, you

565

00:34:06,047 --> 00:34:09,866

know, we marketed the event and you showed up? And 99% of

566

00:34:09,962 --> 00:34:13,733

everybody who responded to my informal survey said they came for this

567

00:34:13,733 --> 00:34:17,407

purpose. So that shows me like retail has the opportunity

568

00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:21,226

to animate in a new way beyond just having products on a shelf or behind

569

00:34:21,226 --> 00:34:25,030

a counter. Animate in a new way, bring events like our podcast to

570

00:34:25,078 --> 00:34:28,883

their stores and to their floors and bring in

571

00:34:28,980 --> 00:34:32,383

new customers that would not have been wandering in otherwise. I love that. It's like

572

00:34:32,528 --> 00:34:36,268

it seems like your marketing brain is always like on for these opportunities.

573

00:34:37,023 --> 00:34:40,282

Well, I mean, I love retail, you know, and retail is, you know,

574

00:34:40,811 --> 00:34:44,616

Saks and other stores. It's a very challenging time for them. They really

575

00:34:45,114 --> 00:34:48,389

needed to pivot a long time ago. Right. So the businesses are really struggling.

576

00:34:48,886 --> 00:34:52,717

But this type of discovery that you can have and that feeling you

577

00:34:52,733 --> 00:34:55,779

have when you find something you like in a store that you like, it's entertainment,

578

00:34:55,859 --> 00:34:59,418

right? It makes you feel good. And I'm actually like a perfect

579

00:34:59,803 --> 00:35:03,217

target for this because I actually hate shopping. Like, I don't want to try things

580

00:35:03,393 --> 00:35:06,455

on, you know, I don't want to return things if they don't fit. You know,

581

00:35:06,471 --> 00:35:09,822

it just sort of feels like a hassle. But if you can engage me in

582

00:35:09,822 --> 00:35:13,444

a shopping experience, you can engage anybody. So I would love to

583

00:35:13,444 --> 00:35:16,843

see our show move back to some retail floors

584

00:35:17,340 --> 00:35:20,899

and bring in that entertainment and education value to

585

00:35:21,284 --> 00:35:24,732

the environment and draw in more shoppers. I love that. If we're having this

586

00:35:24,732 --> 00:35:28,278

conversation a year from now, what would need to have happened for you

587

00:35:28,502 --> 00:35:32,304

to be happy with the progress of the show? Oh, just like keep doing it.

588

00:35:32,512 --> 00:35:36,009

Like, like I said, it is free therapy for me. It's free business coaching.

589

00:35:36,699 --> 00:35:39,891

I get to, you know, first of all, I get to invite friends to the

590

00:35:39,891 --> 00:35:43,308

show, right? People I've known for a long time. I get to twist the arms

591

00:35:43,340 --> 00:35:46,083

of friends that I've known for a long time who've been resistant to come on

592

00:35:46,083 --> 00:35:48,874

this show, and then they do and they like it. I get to meet so

593

00:35:48,874 --> 00:35:52,209

many new people, people I would never have met, you know, with all the conferences

594

00:35:52,306 --> 00:35:56,074

and all the meetings I have, I still can't meet everybody, right? So I

595

00:35:56,090 --> 00:35:59,522

get to sit down and have really honest, frank, vulnerable

596

00:35:59,522 --> 00:36:03,370

conversations with people that, you know, you can't do that over

597

00:36:03,370 --> 00:36:05,551

the phone. You can't be like, hey, like, let me send you an email and

598

00:36:05,551 --> 00:36:08,822

you'll talk vulnerably to me. Like, that doesn't happen. Somehow magically happens on a

599

00:36:08,822 --> 00:36:12,574

podcast, right? Well, I had a client for many

600

00:36:12,671 --> 00:36:16,409

years and we did, you know, photo shoots together and

601

00:36:16,457 --> 00:36:19,171

like created content together. So we were in front of each other quite a bit

602

00:36:19,171 --> 00:36:22,928

for many years. But when you're in these work environments, like, the work is what

603

00:36:22,944 --> 00:36:26,412

we're doing, right? That's what's coming first. When she came onto my show,

604

00:36:26,958 --> 00:36:30,667

I learned so much about her, things that she never revealed, and I really

605

00:36:30,731 --> 00:36:34,440

couldn't ask. Yeah, like, you know, sitting there watching the

606

00:36:34,440 --> 00:36:37,893

photo shoot happen, right? But because of the podcast, because the

607

00:36:37,893 --> 00:36:41,136

topic of the podcast is really about you,

608

00:36:41,569 --> 00:36:45,309

career journey, right? It's not about what you're selling at work, right? It's about you.

609

00:36:45,935 --> 00:36:49,691

It opens the door for people to drop their guard and

610

00:36:49,691 --> 00:36:53,463

relax into the fact that like they actually do wanna talk about this and they

611

00:36:53,463 --> 00:36:56,577

need someone to talk about it with too, right? Because they're, you know, alone in

612

00:36:56,577 --> 00:36:59,995

their head just as much as I am. Regarding the show, what do you wish

613

00:37:00,060 --> 00:37:03,703

someone had told you earlier? Well, you know, it's interesting because

614

00:37:04,056 --> 00:37:07,828

with this show I had no preconceived notion of

615

00:37:07,828 --> 00:37:11,425

what this could become. Harry, with my business, like,

616

00:37:11,441 --> 00:37:14,863

that's where all the anxiety and the stress and like mentalness

617

00:37:15,441 --> 00:37:19,103

comes into play, because in my head the business was supposed to do X, Y,

618

00:37:19,151 --> 00:37:22,171

and Z in a certain amount of time, blah, blah, blah. But with the podcast,

619

00:37:22,203 --> 00:37:25,544

it's like, I'll just give it a try. I don't, you know, there's no expectation

620

00:37:25,640 --> 00:37:29,398

here. So I would say the podcast has taught me that I can

621

00:37:29,495 --> 00:37:33,285

sort of rewrite what the business purpose is, right? I

622

00:37:33,285 --> 00:37:36,947

can, like I said earlier, like drop my guard a little bit on what the

623

00:37:36,963 --> 00:37:40,752

story of the business is, relax into it more, not

624

00:37:40,752 --> 00:37:44,477

pretend that perfection is even attainable, relax into

625

00:37:44,686 --> 00:37:48,427

the bumps in the road. So having the podcast and like the way I behave

626

00:37:48,539 --> 00:37:51,831

with the podcast and my sort of like lightness about it and how much I

627

00:37:51,831 --> 00:37:55,556

enjoy it, it's really taught me that I can try to achieve some more

628

00:37:55,604 --> 00:37:59,105

of that in my business. So how's it changed? And it sounds like it has,

629

00:37:59,362 --> 00:38:03,113

like how you lead. Well, in my podcast, I

630

00:38:03,210 --> 00:38:06,799

get to be me, right? Like, I am just me. This is just who I

631

00:38:06,831 --> 00:38:08,994

am. The way I am with you is the way that I am, you know,

632

00:38:09,234 --> 00:38:13,016

at CVS. And I just want to be me in my

633

00:38:13,080 --> 00:38:16,813

day job too, right? And sometimes it's like, well, I'm— there's

634

00:38:16,910 --> 00:38:20,547

the CEO Jodi. Yeah. And then there's the Jodi Jodi, the

635

00:38:20,547 --> 00:38:23,543

CVS. And right, this is Jodi.

636

00:38:24,120 --> 00:38:27,453

And well, sometimes I have to be CEO Jodi, right?

637

00:38:27,902 --> 00:38:31,321

But for the most part, I really just want to be CBS Jodi

638

00:38:31,658 --> 00:38:35,044

or, you know, see you in town Jodi or like see you at the gym

639

00:38:35,044 --> 00:38:38,640

Jodi. So I have this outlet that lets me be myself and ask the

640

00:38:38,640 --> 00:38:41,432

questions that are really top of mind. I would say like I do get to

641

00:38:41,464 --> 00:38:45,204

be that way mostly in my business except, you know, when CEO Jodi has

642

00:38:45,236 --> 00:38:48,591

to step in and my COO Sarah would, you know, sometimes

643

00:38:48,767 --> 00:38:52,459

present like a challenging decision to me and I'd say to her,

644

00:38:52,603 --> 00:38:56,168

well, Jodi, Jody wants it this way. She's like, but I need to know what

645

00:38:56,168 --> 00:38:59,686

CEO Jody wants, right? So, but for the most part, I get to be

646

00:38:59,686 --> 00:39:03,445

myself. And earlier in my career, I was playing a

647

00:39:03,445 --> 00:39:06,593

role, right? I wasn't really me. I was like who I thought I'm supposed to

648

00:39:06,593 --> 00:39:09,934

be. So this being the host of a podcast, it's really

649

00:39:09,966 --> 00:39:13,580

relaxed me into just like, you know, I love myself, I like myself, I want

650

00:39:13,580 --> 00:39:17,419

to show up as myself. I just have this tendency to bounce between the entrepreneurial

651

00:39:17,419 --> 00:39:20,695

questions and the podcast questions, but What was your most important hire

652

00:39:21,310 --> 00:39:24,369

at the agency? Oof. I mean, that's like sort of like seasons,

653

00:39:25,070 --> 00:39:28,780

right? So most important early on was actually just being able to

654

00:39:28,780 --> 00:39:32,425

hire somebody, right? There was, so there was me and then I would have a

655

00:39:32,425 --> 00:39:35,330

whole bunch of freelancers, right? So I'd only pay them when I had a project

656

00:39:35,330 --> 00:39:39,113

for them and that's fine, but you know, chaotic. And then I was

657

00:39:39,145 --> 00:39:42,960

doing that with, you know, someone again and again and she turned to

658

00:39:42,960 --> 00:39:45,476

me and she was early in her career. She's like, I really need a full-time

659

00:39:45,476 --> 00:39:48,450

job. And I'm like, I don't know if I can give you a full-time job,

660

00:39:48,467 --> 00:39:51,520

right? So being able to get to the point where I gave somebody a full-time

661

00:39:51,600 --> 00:39:55,442

job was amazing. And then, well, then she needed

662

00:39:55,716 --> 00:39:59,083

healthcare, right? I'm like, oh my. So it was like, oh, now I can provide

663

00:39:59,083 --> 00:40:02,498

you healthcare. I can figure that out. So those early moments

664

00:40:02,626 --> 00:40:06,432

of this actually becoming real and rooted, that's

665

00:40:06,432 --> 00:40:10,159

really like very special. But then it's also like these other

666

00:40:10,159 --> 00:40:13,565

seasons in the business where I'm like, hmm, for me to get from point A

667

00:40:13,565 --> 00:40:15,077

to point B, like I'm gonna need a different type of thinker. I'm gonna need

668

00:40:15,077 --> 00:40:18,611

a different level of expertise. That's

669

00:40:18,611 --> 00:40:22,114

expensive. How am I gonna afford that? Right? So being able to build up the

670

00:40:22,114 --> 00:40:24,782

revenue in the business and the stability of the business to be able to make

671

00:40:24,782 --> 00:40:28,493

those hires with experience, I mean, that's thrilling. Yeah. Right there.

672

00:40:28,622 --> 00:40:32,318

There's things that happen in my business every day that I don't know

673

00:40:32,318 --> 00:40:35,981

about, but I used to know everything. Yeah. Right. And I had to, 'cause I

674

00:40:36,014 --> 00:40:39,709

was, you know, one of very few. I get so tickled and like

675

00:40:39,709 --> 00:40:43,389

so many feelings of delight when I find out things I didn't know. Right. Because

676

00:40:43,437 --> 00:40:46,956

I I have this incredible team that puts out great work and that makes our

677

00:40:46,956 --> 00:40:50,796

clients happy and, you know, creates growth for them at the center of

678

00:40:50,796 --> 00:40:54,282

culture, right? So all these things that are important to my team. So yeah, I

679

00:40:54,507 --> 00:40:58,299

like it. My heart like gets all like tickly and happy when I hear

680

00:40:58,299 --> 00:41:01,898

these things. And there's, you know, there's problems that happen that I don't know about

681

00:41:01,898 --> 00:41:05,400

that get fixed. That's a delight. I mean, that's so

682

00:41:05,416 --> 00:41:08,935

exciting. Yeah, it's always a great feeling. It must be to have things

683

00:41:09,127 --> 00:41:12,952

being taken care of. Things that are— maybe you'd probably do them the same

684

00:41:12,984 --> 00:41:16,615

way, but now that you've had people under you that you've trained in your

685

00:41:16,679 --> 00:41:19,781

vision and what you, you know, how you like to do things,

686

00:41:20,697 --> 00:41:24,473

when they can start to do them unaided, that's got to be a really good

687

00:41:24,473 --> 00:41:28,056

feeling, right? Well, I have a team now where like we have

688

00:41:28,169 --> 00:41:32,009

like experienced leadership and that doesn't

689

00:41:32,105 --> 00:41:35,657

always just apply to the client work. Certainly does on a daily basis,

690

00:41:35,721 --> 00:41:39,503

but problems in the office, problems with staffing, like to be able to turn to

691

00:41:39,503 --> 00:41:43,317

people who have experience and I'm not in it alone, right?

692

00:41:43,557 --> 00:41:46,570

Like I have people who've been there to talk to.

693

00:41:47,403 --> 00:41:50,768

I mean, that feeling will never fade, you know, because for so many years, you

694

00:41:50,768 --> 00:41:54,389

know, I was really like the decision maker on everything and I was sort of

695

00:41:54,389 --> 00:41:58,123

felt like I was making decisions in the dark, you know. And then when

696

00:41:58,219 --> 00:42:01,728

I brought on an experienced COO and

697

00:42:01,760 --> 00:42:04,642

CFO all of a sudden they flicked on the light switch

698

00:42:06,348 --> 00:42:09,810

and, you know, what they found was kind of scary, but they fixed it, you

699

00:42:09,810 --> 00:42:13,569

know, and now we make decisions in the light, you know,

700

00:42:13,617 --> 00:42:17,420

informed decisions. It's such a good feeling. It's such a special feeling. So

701

00:42:17,420 --> 00:42:21,077

I would, you know, to answer your questions more succinctly, there's different seasons, different moments

702

00:42:21,465 --> 00:42:24,215

of people, and that will continue. There's going to, you know, there's things in the

703

00:42:24,215 --> 00:42:27,336

future where like I'm going to set my sight on a next goal and we're

704

00:42:27,336 --> 00:42:30,403

going to need, you know, a different type of hire for that. I can't wait.

705

00:42:30,451 --> 00:42:34,256

I'm so excited. Well, I, I really have enjoyed this conversation and to

706

00:42:34,288 --> 00:42:37,339

hear about your journey. It's been inspiring and a lot of fun, and I love

707

00:42:37,339 --> 00:42:41,112

the enthusiasm and the energy you've brought to this conversation and that you bring to

708

00:42:41,112 --> 00:42:44,451

your podcast as well. I think that's what makes it fun for you to keep

709

00:42:44,484 --> 00:42:47,663

going. And I have a couple questions I ask as we wrap up these

710

00:42:47,711 --> 00:42:51,500

conversations. The first one is, what is something that you've changed your mind about

711

00:42:51,693 --> 00:42:55,353

recently? Harry just asked me a very hard question, which is why there's

712

00:42:55,402 --> 00:42:58,917

silence. And I love silence in the podcast because I, I

713

00:42:58,917 --> 00:43:01,805

remind people that's what happens in a real conversation.

714

00:43:03,667 --> 00:43:07,389

Right. So Harry asked me what recently I've changed my mind about,

715

00:43:08,143 --> 00:43:11,416

and I'm a little stumped. I'm a very

716

00:43:11,513 --> 00:43:15,299

decisive person and I'm not afraid to make

717

00:43:15,299 --> 00:43:18,957

decisions, even the hard ones. I also

718

00:43:19,134 --> 00:43:22,808

have learned to trust myself. So nothing is

719

00:43:22,840 --> 00:43:26,274

coming to mind because, you know, certainly I've made decisions that like maybe didn't go

720

00:43:26,274 --> 00:43:29,912

our way. But like, that's the learning, right? And I do know that

721

00:43:29,912 --> 00:43:33,662

like every brick wall I run through has like a lot of valuable learning, like

722

00:43:33,662 --> 00:43:37,428

almost like equal to money on the other side. But I'm stumped here, Harry.

723

00:43:37,813 --> 00:43:41,210

I mean, sometimes people give me answers that are as simple as I switched from

724

00:43:41,258 --> 00:43:45,040

coffee to tea. I don't drink coffee, so I

725

00:43:45,232 --> 00:43:48,902

don't think I ever will. What is the most misunderstood thing about you?

726

00:43:49,431 --> 00:43:53,182

Oh, okay. So the most misunderstood thing about me I

727

00:43:53,294 --> 00:43:56,683

think it's that people think that this is all easy for me,

728

00:43:57,454 --> 00:44:00,633

right? I told you I show up measured and I have a lot of joy.

729

00:44:01,179 --> 00:44:05,018

So usually with a smile. And I actually have like a

730

00:44:05,082 --> 00:44:08,631

ton of anxiety about this. Like, this is so hard

731

00:44:08,952 --> 00:44:12,325

and like it would be hard on a normal day, but you have to add

732

00:44:12,325 --> 00:44:16,163

in the volatility of the marketplace to it, right? Every client we have

733

00:44:16,163 --> 00:44:19,920

has a CFO who's decided, no, we're not spending money because of the volatility. Which

734

00:44:20,033 --> 00:44:23,720

means, well, how do we make money, right? So, and that's just

735

00:44:24,200 --> 00:44:27,374

one place where there's instability in the marketplace. There's many others.

736

00:44:27,984 --> 00:44:31,654

So, you know, I go to sleep at night thinking about, you know,

737

00:44:31,671 --> 00:44:35,325

these, you know, scary thoughts about like, you know, what kind of pivots do we

738

00:44:35,325 --> 00:44:38,916

need to make to be able to keep the business or get the business in

739

00:44:38,948 --> 00:44:42,363

these business— in these marketplace conditions? I wake up in the morning with those

740

00:44:42,635 --> 00:44:46,482

same concerns. Are we staffed right for this work? Are

741

00:44:46,482 --> 00:44:49,801

we, you know, do we have the right timeline for this work, right? Even though

742

00:44:49,801 --> 00:44:53,263

I'm not in the work every day the way I was years ago, well, it's

743

00:44:53,279 --> 00:44:57,045

certainly still on my mind, right? So I think people would think

744

00:44:57,045 --> 00:45:00,539

like it's just kind of easy breezy for me and it's really not.

745

00:45:00,891 --> 00:45:04,641

Well, I appreciate, you know, I love these long-form conversations 'cause they're an opportunity

746

00:45:04,657 --> 00:45:08,472

for you to be honest about what's happening in your world and not

747

00:45:08,504 --> 00:45:12,254

try to paint a picture of something that's not there. And I think people

748

00:45:12,286 --> 00:45:15,700

listening also can appreciate, especially if you're, whether it's on the podcasting

749

00:45:15,732 --> 00:45:19,418

side or business side or career side, like I think

750

00:45:19,498 --> 00:45:22,930

we need to be more upfront about saying these things out

751

00:45:22,946 --> 00:45:26,607

loud and the fact that it's okay. Like therapy has been extremely

752

00:45:26,623 --> 00:45:30,301

helpful for me and I've talked about my coming out of the spiritual closet

753

00:45:30,349 --> 00:45:33,208

journey as well on the show and just all these little things that in the

754

00:45:33,208 --> 00:45:36,982

past would be taboo. And I think we need to realize that there's a

755

00:45:36,982 --> 00:45:40,515

human being on the other side of these conversations that are struggling with stuff.

756

00:45:40,628 --> 00:45:44,064

And I've had that same experience of like waking up anxious because of

757

00:45:44,064 --> 00:45:47,822

business-related stuff or losing a big client. And it's just like,

758

00:45:47,903 --> 00:45:51,259

I wasn't, you know, and it's on the days you least expected and least wanted.

759

00:45:51,772 --> 00:45:55,539

So I appreciate you being open to that as well. Well, no one

760

00:45:55,539 --> 00:45:59,242

ever wants to lose a client, but I can tell you that like, if

761

00:45:59,290 --> 00:46:03,089

I'm like well fed and hydrated and I had enough sleep,

762

00:46:03,714 --> 00:46:06,856

when these things happen, I really am able to see them as like

763

00:46:07,144 --> 00:46:10,815

opportunities. Right. And we've had times, you know,

764

00:46:10,911 --> 00:46:14,614

growing pains or like we had a client that was very high

765

00:46:14,614 --> 00:46:18,157

profile, had very, you know, significant needs and we were not meeting their

766

00:46:18,221 --> 00:46:22,027

needs. And it was a mess and it was a really important client to me.

767

00:46:22,562 --> 00:46:26,288

And, but what I learned from that is like, oh, we don't have the right

768

00:46:26,288 --> 00:46:29,830

process, we don't have the right people. And I like, where can you get that

769

00:46:29,943 --> 00:46:33,435

lesson, right? And first of all, the client's paying us, so we're being paid to

770

00:46:33,435 --> 00:46:37,251

learn in some sense, right? So we completely rebuilt the way that

771

00:46:37,299 --> 00:46:40,301

we do our work and the way that we staff our work so that we

772

00:46:40,301 --> 00:46:43,302

can be great at this. 'Cause I knew we could be, right? It hurt that

773

00:46:43,302 --> 00:46:46,924

we weren't, being great at it, but we rebuilt it

774

00:46:47,100 --> 00:46:50,947

and now we are beyond great at it. So if I'm not well fed,

775

00:46:50,963 --> 00:46:54,809

if I'm not well rested and not well hydrated, I'm not, I'm not

776

00:46:54,809 --> 00:46:58,479

able to see the positive. But you know, once I sort of get myself

777

00:46:58,479 --> 00:47:02,149

rooted in those basics, I'm able to realize like how fundamentally

778

00:47:02,181 --> 00:47:04,986

exciting it is to be able to live that way. Nobody wants to be in

779

00:47:04,986 --> 00:47:08,496

the hangry zone. No, I'm not good as hangry.

780

00:47:08,816 --> 00:47:12,198

You don't wanna be around the hangry person. Well, thanks again, Jodi. I really, really

781

00:47:12,198 --> 00:47:15,868

enjoyed this conversation and getting to know you. And about the show and about the

782

00:47:15,868 --> 00:47:19,153

agency. Is there anything else that you haven't shared or anything that's coming to mind?

783

00:47:19,233 --> 00:47:22,870

Yeah, I want to give something that I learned. If anyone out there

784

00:47:22,934 --> 00:47:26,620

wants to do these like marathon days of live recording in front of an audience,

785

00:47:26,780 --> 00:47:29,920

I want to share my like checklist of how I actually get through the day,

786

00:47:30,545 --> 00:47:33,654

okay? Because I had to work through this in therapy and coaching to get there

787

00:47:33,654 --> 00:47:36,650

because it is a big day. First of all, the night before I do like

788

00:47:36,715 --> 00:47:39,695

food prep, you know, as if I was like going to a sports thing. Like

789

00:47:39,823 --> 00:47:43,302

I make like an almond butter sandwich. I get my

790

00:47:44,152 --> 00:47:47,553

coconut water bottle ready. I make sure I have a big

791

00:47:47,777 --> 00:47:51,627

water bottle. I make sure I have all the snacks that I need, and I

792

00:47:51,691 --> 00:47:55,460

try to get a good night's sleep. Then in the morning, I will have like

793

00:47:55,460 --> 00:47:58,845

a really hearty breakfast, like a bacon, egg, and cheese, you know, something that's like,

794

00:47:59,005 --> 00:48:02,678

like so hearty there's no way I'm getting hungry anytime fast. Right,

795

00:48:02,694 --> 00:48:05,710

right. And I will take preventative

796

00:48:05,982 --> 00:48:09,575

Excedrin. So I take Excedrin with my breakfast.

797

00:48:09,912 --> 00:48:13,710

Because it has the caffeine, which is nice too, but it's going to help with

798

00:48:13,758 --> 00:48:17,171

any migraines that are going to come on. And inevitably they will come

799

00:48:17,347 --> 00:48:21,097

on because of all that intense listening, right? I'm

800

00:48:21,193 --> 00:48:24,815

not breathing, right? I'm like listening but not breathing. So

801

00:48:25,039 --> 00:48:28,420

I take the Excedrin early in the day to prevent that migraine that will ultimately

802

00:48:28,420 --> 00:48:32,218

have come later when, when the adrenaline wears off. And then

803

00:48:32,346 --> 00:48:35,680

in between each episode, I go into a closed-door room

804

00:48:36,257 --> 00:48:39,837

on the other side of the event space. And I take a deep breath, I

805

00:48:39,885 --> 00:48:43,626

take some sips of that coconut water, I have some snacks, and then

806

00:48:44,043 --> 00:48:47,639

I take a deep breath and then go back out there and do the next

807

00:48:47,655 --> 00:48:51,171

episode. So this has worked for me every single time. I've

808

00:48:51,187 --> 00:48:54,959

walked out of my events without a migraine, which is such a delight.

809

00:48:55,441 --> 00:48:58,957

And I'm not like starving for lunch, you know, because I had that really hearty

810

00:48:59,213 --> 00:49:03,018

breakfast and I'm very well hydrated. I love that checklist.

811

00:49:03,082 --> 00:49:06,866

And whether you're doing a show in your format or even like solo, casters, I

812

00:49:06,866 --> 00:49:10,045

think it's a reminder. Mm-hmm. Because I've made the mistake of booking several

813

00:49:10,094 --> 00:49:13,321

back-to-backs of these remotely and I see them on the calendar and it's like, oh,

814

00:49:13,563 --> 00:49:17,229

I don't have any breaks. I don't pull those in. And I think, yeah,

815

00:49:17,245 --> 00:49:20,844

having that reset time is helpful. So thank you for that. And we'll make sure

816

00:49:20,844 --> 00:49:24,478

that's outlined in the show notes. Again, truly enjoyed the conversation and

817

00:49:24,494 --> 00:49:27,875

connecting with you. I'm really glad your team reached out. Appreciate it. Where's the best

818

00:49:27,891 --> 00:49:31,579

place for folks to connect and learn more about what you're working on? Well, they

819

00:49:31,579 --> 00:49:34,544

can go to basebeauty.com, but the other option, I am big on LinkedIn. You know,

820

00:49:34,561 --> 00:49:38,274

that's my place. I actually don't have any personal social That's the

821

00:49:38,338 --> 00:49:42,150

only one. So I'm very active on LinkedIn and happy to answer anyone's

822

00:49:42,150 --> 00:49:44,803

questions. Okay. I'll make sure all those links in the show notes. Thanks again, Jord.

823

00:49:45,029 --> 00:49:47,827

Thanks again, Jodi. Awesome. Thank you. It was really fun, Harry. All right.